IMMERSED IN DESIRE (pt II)
Cast photos courtesy of the Irene Collective
Immersed in Desire: Irene Collective beckon audiences closer in a new production of Tennesse Williams' classic, New Orleans-set play
Interview by Paul Oswell
Irene Collective, a New Orleans based theatre company, presents their production of A STREETCAR NAMED DESIRE by Tennessee Williams, directed by Hanna Hall and Jaclyn Bethany . The production will run from March 19th - April 3rd (with a student preview on March 17th) at Big Couch New Orleans. We spoke to
- Click here for Part I: our chat with company founder, director and principal cast member Jaclyn Bethany
OAD: Hi Jaclyn, thank you for taking time out of rehearsals and preparation to talk to us. I think even in the short time that Out All Day has existed (coming up on five years) we've seen and reviewed multiple versions of Streetcar, and there are probably a couple of productions every year in New Orleans in various forms. It's a play that just keeps audiences coming back. What made you decide to stage a take of your own?
Jaclyn Bethany: The play, and Tennessee Williams are part of the cultural infrastructure of the city in a very unique way. It is one of the greatest plays ever written, and that allows many different, evolving interpretations in one of America's greatest cities. Tennessee and Streetcar have also been a big part of me for a long time. I grew up in Jackson, Mississippi, which is not far from where Blanche and Stella grew up. I remember reading The Glass Menagerie and Streetcar in High School. I felt very moved, and also seen. I was very lucky that once I decided I wanted to be a performer, I have had a very supportive family. In high school, I saw the late, great Natasha Richardson play Blanche, I saw Jessica Lange play Amanda (in Menagerie), and in college I saw Liv Ullman's production of Streetcar starring Cate Blanchett. I think that production changed my life. I also played Blanche in high school. However, the exploration of Williams' work is much more than being a performer. As a young girl I was always considered different. I identified with the artistic vulnerability in Tennessee's words, and his exploration of queerness, often through his women. For the past decade, I have produced and directed work that explores him and his world. During the pandemic, I returned home to Mississippi after living away for some time. I re-visited the Williams canon. I subsequently played Laura in The Glass Menagerie in several different productions, which led me to read his letters and discover early drafts of Streetcar. What struck me about these was the focus on the sisters. Our production focuses on two intelligent, independent women who have made different choices that have not only affected their relationship, but how they can survive in a brutal, misogynistic society. The show is also rarely directed by women, and it's a woman's story. I have presented my feminist perspective on Williams and his women at conferences worldwide. The build up to stage this show has been years of work for me, and I am so grateful to Hanna and our incredible team.
It's a more intimate production, just 55 seats per night at Big Couch. Did the venue come about and then that shaped the direction that you would take, or were you actively looking from the start for a smaller theatre with this kind of production specifically in mind?
It is actually less! Around 40. I think the room can fit up to 55, but the way we are staging it, with a full shotgun house built in the theater, this number is now too many! The production had a few different iterations. We were originally going to stage it outside with a bigger audience. However, we always knew that we wanted some kind of immersive aspect and we always wanted live music. I have worked with Big Couch since they opened. I have actually never seen Streetcar staged in this way. The audience is basically in the house. It's really interesting, raw and intimate. It's cinematic in that way. I think the way our space is set up, it immediately creates a feeling and world.
Tennessee Williams wrote this in 1947. What is it about our particular cultural moment that perhaps made you feel the play needed to be staged today?
The world today, and the America we are living in is chaotic, brutal and tragic. There is so much fear. There is a beautiful line that Blanche says to Mitch: "There is so much confusion in the world. Thank you for being so kind. I need kindness now-", and her speech to Stella where she speaks of the death of the arts - of poetry and music. Stanley represents the constant brutality of our world, and Blanche is just trying to survive. There was not a particular moment for me, but art is inherently reflective of the world. In 1947, America was searching for its identity in a post WWII landscape. The war changed everyone. Now, we are a country at war. Women are losing their rights. The parallels are frightening.
The characters have become almost mythological, partly thanks to the film adaptation of course. How do you free the roles (and in turn your audiences) from those iconic performances, and what new dimensions are you trying to explore with the cast?
Across the board, we wanted the cast to reflect the diversity and passion of New Orleans. We are deeply excited about the incredible cast we have assembled. We took eight months to cast the show. We worked with a Casting Director, who is also our Producer, Hunter McHugh, to find the right actors for our vision both in New Orleans and beyond. I didn't really think about the iconic-ness of it all. The film became overshadowed by Stanely simply because it was the discovery of a major star. As a performer you really have to try to distance yourself. The specificity and believability of the relationships and the tension between all the characters has been our overriding theme. You must believe that Stella and Blanche are sisters, and that Stanley has a specific energy that tears the women apart. We also wanted this staging to focus on Mitch, as I think his scenes with Blanche are the most honest in the play. Sometimes Mitch gets brushed to the side, or you just do not believe he is an actual real option for Blanche. He is absolutely integral to her journey and tragedy. I also don't believe Blanche is full of Hollywood glamour. I think she wants to be beautiful, that's a part of her and an expectation as a genteel Southern woman, but there are so many qualities she possesses that often get overshadowed that we are exploring - her intelligence, her wit, her power, her vulnerability, and her shame connected to her sexuality. Stella, too, in our production is a strong, intelligent woman, who is in love with Stanley. She is as independent as she can be in a man's world, and she is becoming a mother. In my opinion, motherhood is something Blanche will never have because she is removed from society. Of the two sisters, Stella is living a life more expected of a woman, yet she is stuck in an abusive relationship.
Williams is writing about very specific collisions between the Old South and the brutality of the new America. Does that geography and time still resonate, or are you reframing the class and cultural tensions for a contemporary audience?
We are absolutely framing it for a modern audience, while also keeping it honest. The juxtaposition between class, and New/Old South comes out immediately when Blanche arrives in New Orleans. A great example of how we are framing this is in Blanche's speech where she describes the loss of Belle Reve, through her words she is actually describing the horrors of living at that decaying plantation. You cannot shy away from it. This is a truthful speech and not a massive performance piece. We want the audience to feel that horror and pain. I also hope, because I am from where Blanche is from, that it is reflected in my performance how difficult it is to be from a place like Mississippi. Blanche herself is fighting this confused identity, while Stella has completely moved on from it. It creates tension between them, and also with Stanley, who is representative of the incoming brutality and modern world - which ultimately destroys Blanche.
The sexual politics are raw and, even by today's standards, disturbing. Could you talk to how you approached the more controversial scenes?
We are staging them. They are not off stage. There are some things, of course, that are implied and not seen, because it is theatre, and everything is safe! However, it was really important for our vision to go for these scenes and not shy away from them. In our production, Blanche is a sex worker. For some time, after she lost her teaching job, this is how she survived. The theme of shame is really resonant for me, and that permeates through every particle of Blanche. She is trying so hard to mask who she really is, until she no longer can.
The play is saturated in desire, delusion, and violence. Do you see the story as a tragedy, or is it something more ambiguous? How does that shape the directorial approach?
We have made the clear choice that it is a tragedy. We are staging a full breakdown at the end of the play. That is what Tennessee wrote. His sister, Rose Williams, had recently been lobotomized. In historical accounts of Rose, her sexuality was her demise, and there we have Blanche. He was writing about a woman that could not fit into society, and so she was destroyed. Her own sister was part of her tragedy. This is directly parallel to Tennessee's family, as his mother decided to lobotomize Rose.
Williams described the play as being about "the ravishment of the tender, the sensitive, the delicate by the savage and brutal forces of modern society." Do you agree with his own reading? How much influence does the writer's original intent have?
Yes. I have done a ton of research on the original production and read Elia Kazan's notebooks, Williams's revisions, etc. The original text was very specific in its intent to mix poetry with brutality. There is also this inherent theme of misunderstanding. No one is good or bad. We are doing the play as written. It is just built around our vision as two women in the contemporary American South. In the writing, the most revealing scenes are between the sisters and Mitch. Stanley doesn't understand her. The world doesn't understand Blanche. Ultimately, Stanley's rape of Blanche deprives her of all these qualities. She is crushed. Our company is also named after the original Broadway producer of Streetcar, Irene Mayer Selznick. Many people do not realize that Streetcar was in fact originally championed by women: Tenn's agent Audrey Wood, his confidante/director friend Margot Jones and ultimately, Irene Mayer Selznick, who funded the production. Kazan came on later. Our company is a tribute to all these women, who changed the course of the American theater.
I read in your press release that the production involves "a diverse ensemble of New Orleans artists, musicians and performers". Could you tell us more? Are musicians playing live?
Yes! We have two musicians playing live and a score that was written for the production. Music is so inherent in the world of New Orleans, it is written into the play, and will transport the audience immediately.
Thank you so much for talking to us, Jaclyn, it sounds like an exciting and intriguing production. Its part of the Tennessee Williams Literary Festival, obviously a huge event that has much more going on besides great productions of his plays. What else are you excited to see or take part in at the festival?
I'm speaking on a scholar panel about the show, which I am looking forward to! There are so many events. I want to check out the other theatre events and support local companies. I am also excited to see Laura Venita Green speak, I was quite moved by her book Sister Creatures.
Irene Collective's production of Tennessee Williams' A Streetcar Named Desire plays at Bog Couch New Orleans from March 19th - April 3rd. Click here for more information and ticketing
Interview by Paul Oswell
Irene Collective, a New Orleans based theatre company, presents their production of A STREETCAR NAMED DESIRE by Tennessee Williams, directed by Hanna Hall and Jaclyn Bethany . The production will run from March 19th - April 3rd (with a student preview on March 17th) at Big Couch New Orleans. We spoke to
- Click here for Part I: our chat with company founder, director and principal cast member Jaclyn Bethany
OAD: Hi Jaclyn, thank you for taking time out of rehearsals and preparation to talk to us. I think even in the short time that Out All Day has existed (coming up on five years) we've seen and reviewed multiple versions of Streetcar, and there are probably a couple of productions every year in New Orleans in various forms. It's a play that just keeps audiences coming back. What made you decide to stage a take of your own?
Jaclyn Bethany: The play, and Tennessee Williams are part of the cultural infrastructure of the city in a very unique way. It is one of the greatest plays ever written, and that allows many different, evolving interpretations in one of America's greatest cities. Tennessee and Streetcar have also been a big part of me for a long time. I grew up in Jackson, Mississippi, which is not far from where Blanche and Stella grew up. I remember reading The Glass Menagerie and Streetcar in High School. I felt very moved, and also seen. I was very lucky that once I decided I wanted to be a performer, I have had a very supportive family. In high school, I saw the late, great Natasha Richardson play Blanche, I saw Jessica Lange play Amanda (in Menagerie), and in college I saw Liv Ullman's production of Streetcar starring Cate Blanchett. I think that production changed my life. I also played Blanche in high school. However, the exploration of Williams' work is much more than being a performer. As a young girl I was always considered different. I identified with the artistic vulnerability in Tennessee's words, and his exploration of queerness, often through his women. For the past decade, I have produced and directed work that explores him and his world. During the pandemic, I returned home to Mississippi after living away for some time. I re-visited the Williams canon. I subsequently played Laura in The Glass Menagerie in several different productions, which led me to read his letters and discover early drafts of Streetcar. What struck me about these was the focus on the sisters. Our production focuses on two intelligent, independent women who have made different choices that have not only affected their relationship, but how they can survive in a brutal, misogynistic society. The show is also rarely directed by women, and it's a woman's story. I have presented my feminist perspective on Williams and his women at conferences worldwide. The build up to stage this show has been years of work for me, and I am so grateful to Hanna and our incredible team.
It's a more intimate production, just 55 seats per night at Big Couch. Did the venue come about and then that shaped the direction that you would take, or were you actively looking from the start for a smaller theatre with this kind of production specifically in mind?
It is actually less! Around 40. I think the room can fit up to 55, but the way we are staging it, with a full shotgun house built in the theater, this number is now too many! The production had a few different iterations. We were originally going to stage it outside with a bigger audience. However, we always knew that we wanted some kind of immersive aspect and we always wanted live music. I have worked with Big Couch since they opened. I have actually never seen Streetcar staged in this way. The audience is basically in the house. It's really interesting, raw and intimate. It's cinematic in that way. I think the way our space is set up, it immediately creates a feeling and world.
Tennessee Williams wrote this in 1947. What is it about our particular cultural moment that perhaps made you feel the play needed to be staged today?
The world today, and the America we are living in is chaotic, brutal and tragic. There is so much fear. There is a beautiful line that Blanche says to Mitch: "There is so much confusion in the world. Thank you for being so kind. I need kindness now-", and her speech to Stella where she speaks of the death of the arts - of poetry and music. Stanley represents the constant brutality of our world, and Blanche is just trying to survive. There was not a particular moment for me, but art is inherently reflective of the world. In 1947, America was searching for its identity in a post WWII landscape. The war changed everyone. Now, we are a country at war. Women are losing their rights. The parallels are frightening.
The characters have become almost mythological, partly thanks to the film adaptation of course. How do you free the roles (and in turn your audiences) from those iconic performances, and what new dimensions are you trying to explore with the cast?
Across the board, we wanted the cast to reflect the diversity and passion of New Orleans. We are deeply excited about the incredible cast we have assembled. We took eight months to cast the show. We worked with a Casting Director, who is also our Producer, Hunter McHugh, to find the right actors for our vision both in New Orleans and beyond. I didn't really think about the iconic-ness of it all. The film became overshadowed by Stanely simply because it was the discovery of a major star. As a performer you really have to try to distance yourself. The specificity and believability of the relationships and the tension between all the characters has been our overriding theme. You must believe that Stella and Blanche are sisters, and that Stanley has a specific energy that tears the women apart. We also wanted this staging to focus on Mitch, as I think his scenes with Blanche are the most honest in the play. Sometimes Mitch gets brushed to the side, or you just do not believe he is an actual real option for Blanche. He is absolutely integral to her journey and tragedy. I also don't believe Blanche is full of Hollywood glamour. I think she wants to be beautiful, that's a part of her and an expectation as a genteel Southern woman, but there are so many qualities she possesses that often get overshadowed that we are exploring - her intelligence, her wit, her power, her vulnerability, and her shame connected to her sexuality. Stella, too, in our production is a strong, intelligent woman, who is in love with Stanley. She is as independent as she can be in a man's world, and she is becoming a mother. In my opinion, motherhood is something Blanche will never have because she is removed from society. Of the two sisters, Stella is living a life more expected of a woman, yet she is stuck in an abusive relationship.
Williams is writing about very specific collisions between the Old South and the brutality of the new America. Does that geography and time still resonate, or are you reframing the class and cultural tensions for a contemporary audience?
We are absolutely framing it for a modern audience, while also keeping it honest. The juxtaposition between class, and New/Old South comes out immediately when Blanche arrives in New Orleans. A great example of how we are framing this is in Blanche's speech where she describes the loss of Belle Reve, through her words she is actually describing the horrors of living at that decaying plantation. You cannot shy away from it. This is a truthful speech and not a massive performance piece. We want the audience to feel that horror and pain. I also hope, because I am from where Blanche is from, that it is reflected in my performance how difficult it is to be from a place like Mississippi. Blanche herself is fighting this confused identity, while Stella has completely moved on from it. It creates tension between them, and also with Stanley, who is representative of the incoming brutality and modern world - which ultimately destroys Blanche.
The sexual politics are raw and, even by today's standards, disturbing. Could you talk to how you approached the more controversial scenes?
We are staging them. They are not off stage. There are some things, of course, that are implied and not seen, because it is theatre, and everything is safe! However, it was really important for our vision to go for these scenes and not shy away from them. In our production, Blanche is a sex worker. For some time, after she lost her teaching job, this is how she survived. The theme of shame is really resonant for me, and that permeates through every particle of Blanche. She is trying so hard to mask who she really is, until she no longer can.
The play is saturated in desire, delusion, and violence. Do you see the story as a tragedy, or is it something more ambiguous? How does that shape the directorial approach?
We have made the clear choice that it is a tragedy. We are staging a full breakdown at the end of the play. That is what Tennessee wrote. His sister, Rose Williams, had recently been lobotomized. In historical accounts of Rose, her sexuality was her demise, and there we have Blanche. He was writing about a woman that could not fit into society, and so she was destroyed. Her own sister was part of her tragedy. This is directly parallel to Tennessee's family, as his mother decided to lobotomize Rose.
Williams described the play as being about "the ravishment of the tender, the sensitive, the delicate by the savage and brutal forces of modern society." Do you agree with his own reading? How much influence does the writer's original intent have?
Yes. I have done a ton of research on the original production and read Elia Kazan's notebooks, Williams's revisions, etc. The original text was very specific in its intent to mix poetry with brutality. There is also this inherent theme of misunderstanding. No one is good or bad. We are doing the play as written. It is just built around our vision as two women in the contemporary American South. In the writing, the most revealing scenes are between the sisters and Mitch. Stanley doesn't understand her. The world doesn't understand Blanche. Ultimately, Stanley's rape of Blanche deprives her of all these qualities. She is crushed. Our company is also named after the original Broadway producer of Streetcar, Irene Mayer Selznick. Many people do not realize that Streetcar was in fact originally championed by women: Tenn's agent Audrey Wood, his confidante/director friend Margot Jones and ultimately, Irene Mayer Selznick, who funded the production. Kazan came on later. Our company is a tribute to all these women, who changed the course of the American theater.
I read in your press release that the production involves "a diverse ensemble of New Orleans artists, musicians and performers". Could you tell us more? Are musicians playing live?
Yes! We have two musicians playing live and a score that was written for the production. Music is so inherent in the world of New Orleans, it is written into the play, and will transport the audience immediately.
Thank you so much for talking to us, Jaclyn, it sounds like an exciting and intriguing production. Its part of the Tennessee Williams Literary Festival, obviously a huge event that has much more going on besides great productions of his plays. What else are you excited to see or take part in at the festival?
I'm speaking on a scholar panel about the show, which I am looking forward to! There are so many events. I want to check out the other theatre events and support local companies. I am also excited to see Laura Venita Green speak, I was quite moved by her book Sister Creatures.
Irene Collective's production of Tennessee Williams' A Streetcar Named Desire plays at Bog Couch New Orleans from March 19th - April 3rd. Click here for more information and ticketing